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	<title>Comments on: Software patents &#8211; unwelcome and unwanted</title>
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	<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/</link>
	<description>Writings on technology and society from Wellington, New Zealand</description>
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		<title>By: A Note from the new Cyberlaw Fellow : CyberLaw</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-7494</link>
		<dc:creator>A Note from the new Cyberlaw Fellow : CyberLaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 22:22:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-7494</guid>
		<description>[...] Government&#8217;s new Broadband roll out, the continuing debate on Section 92A, or the issue of software patents and forthcoming patent reform.    September 21, 2009 &#124; Filed Under [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Government&#8217;s new Broadband roll out, the continuing debate on Section 92A, or the issue of software patents and forthcoming patent reform.    September 21, 2009 | Filed Under [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Lawrence D'Oliveiro</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-6509</link>
		<dc:creator>Lawrence D'Oliveiro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 10:20:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-6509</guid>
		<description>If software should be patentable because it can replicate the functions of hardware, can that same argument be used the other way? To make mechanisms copyrightable because they can replicate the functions of software? If not, why not?

Patents ARE monopolies. Monopolies are anticompetitive. End of story.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If software should be patentable because it can replicate the functions of hardware, can that same argument be used the other way? To make mechanisms copyrightable because they can replicate the functions of software? If not, why not?</p>
<p>Patents ARE monopolies. Monopolies are anticompetitive. End of story.</p>
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		<title>By: Ken</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-6291</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 22:45:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-6291</guid>
		<description>I side with Dale and not Colin - just look at the basic functions of a processor such as AND, they are performed using harware.  The engineer has the choice to use all hardware logic to control a machine or use a programmed embedded system. Why would it be wrong for an avionics designer to get a patent for an embedded system even where the only inventive activity related to the software?  We need to be more precise when talking about &quot;software patents&quot;.

This includes distinguishing them from business method patents.  In any event the first of those which reached the High Court was invalidated on the bsis it was not an invention as defined under today&#039;s equivalent of the Bill&#039;s clause 13.  And clause 13 has been drafted to ensure the applicability of decisions of the courts under the existing Patents Act, such as excluding claimed processes which are in reality no more than what the law calls &quot;mere schemes&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I side with Dale and not Colin &#8211; just look at the basic functions of a processor such as AND, they are performed using harware.  The engineer has the choice to use all hardware logic to control a machine or use a programmed embedded system. Why would it be wrong for an avionics designer to get a patent for an embedded system even where the only inventive activity related to the software?  We need to be more precise when talking about &#8220;software patents&#8221;.</p>
<p>This includes distinguishing them from business method patents.  In any event the first of those which reached the High Court was invalidated on the bsis it was not an invention as defined under today&#8217;s equivalent of the Bill&#8217;s clause 13.  And clause 13 has been drafted to ensure the applicability of decisions of the courts under the existing Patents Act, such as excluding claimed processes which are in reality no more than what the law calls &#8220;mere schemes&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: colin</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-5260</link>
		<dc:creator>colin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:13:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-5260</guid>
		<description>Dale

It&#039;s certainly not true that &quot;as any electrical engineer knows&quot; software may be replaced by hardware. It&#039;s fanciful to consider building a hardware machine to replace something as complex as, say, Linux or Windows with no software components. The machine would be huge, and desperately uneconomic. The word &quot;impractical&quot; doesn&#039;t begin to describe this notion.

Using arguments like this should get someone laughed out of court.

Colin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dale</p>
<p>It&#8217;s certainly not true that &#8220;as any electrical engineer knows&#8221; software may be replaced by hardware. It&#8217;s fanciful to consider building a hardware machine to replace something as complex as, say, Linux or Windows with no software components. The machine would be huge, and desperately uneconomic. The word &#8220;impractical&#8221; doesn&#8217;t begin to describe this notion.</p>
<p>Using arguments like this should get someone laughed out of court.</p>
<p>Colin</p>
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		<title>By: Dale Halling</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-5237</link>
		<dc:creator>Dale Halling</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 15:12:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-5237</guid>
		<description>The arguments against software patents have a fundamental flaw.  As any electrical engineer knows, solutions to problems implemented in software can also be realized in hardware, i.e., electronic circuits.  The main reason for choosing a software solution is the ease in implementing changes, the main reason for choosing a hardware solution is speed of processing.  Therefore, a time critical solution is more likely to be implemented in hardware.  While a solution that requires the ability to add features easily will be implemented in software.  As a result, to be intellectually consistent those people against software patents also have to be against patents for electronic circuits.  For more information on patents and innovation see www.hallingblog.com.  


The Myth that Patents are a Monopoly

A patent gives the holder the right to exclude others from making, using or selling their invention.  35 USC 154.  It does not give the holder the right to make, use or sell their invention.  A monopoly is an exclusive right to a market, such as an electric utility company.  An electric utility company has the exclusive right to sell electricity in a certain territory.  Since a patent does not even given the holder the right to sell their invention, let alone an exclusive right to a market, it is clearly not a monopoly.  

When a person describes a patent as a monopoly to be consistent they should also state that they have a monopoly over their car or over their house.  In fact, they have more rights in their car and house than a patent gives the inventor over their invention, since you have a right to use and sell your car or house.  A patent does not give these rights to an inventor over his invention.  All invention are built upon existing elements (conservation of matter) and if the elements that the invention uses are patented, then the inventor will not have the right to sell their invention without a license. 

Some economists argue that a patent is designed to give the holder monopoly power.  Those economists who are consistent also state that all property rights give some monopoly power.  The property rights are monopolies thesis shows how confused economic thought is on this subject.  The only logically consistent definition of a monopoly is an exclusive right to a market.

People who suggest a patent is a monopoly are not being intellectually honest and perpetuating a myth to advance a political agenda. 

For more information on patents and innovation see www.hallingblog.com.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The arguments against software patents have a fundamental flaw.  As any electrical engineer knows, solutions to problems implemented in software can also be realized in hardware, i.e., electronic circuits.  The main reason for choosing a software solution is the ease in implementing changes, the main reason for choosing a hardware solution is speed of processing.  Therefore, a time critical solution is more likely to be implemented in hardware.  While a solution that requires the ability to add features easily will be implemented in software.  As a result, to be intellectually consistent those people against software patents also have to be against patents for electronic circuits.  For more information on patents and innovation see <a href="http://www.hallingblog.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.hallingblog.com</a>.  </p>
<p>The Myth that Patents are a Monopoly</p>
<p>A patent gives the holder the right to exclude others from making, using or selling their invention.  35 USC 154.  It does not give the holder the right to make, use or sell their invention.  A monopoly is an exclusive right to a market, such as an electric utility company.  An electric utility company has the exclusive right to sell electricity in a certain territory.  Since a patent does not even given the holder the right to sell their invention, let alone an exclusive right to a market, it is clearly not a monopoly.  </p>
<p>When a person describes a patent as a monopoly to be consistent they should also state that they have a monopoly over their car or over their house.  In fact, they have more rights in their car and house than a patent gives the inventor over their invention, since you have a right to use and sell your car or house.  A patent does not give these rights to an inventor over his invention.  All invention are built upon existing elements (conservation of matter) and if the elements that the invention uses are patented, then the inventor will not have the right to sell their invention without a license. </p>
<p>Some economists argue that a patent is designed to give the holder monopoly power.  Those economists who are consistent also state that all property rights give some monopoly power.  The property rights are monopolies thesis shows how confused economic thought is on this subject.  The only logically consistent definition of a monopoly is an exclusive right to a market.</p>
<p>People who suggest a patent is a monopoly are not being intellectually honest and perpetuating a myth to advance a political agenda. </p>
<p>For more information on patents and innovation see <a href="http://www.hallingblog.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.hallingblog.com</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob Miller</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-4894</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Miller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 22:31:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-4894</guid>
		<description>We should be alligned with the rest of the world. There is no point in having a different patent system to Europe, Eurasia, USA etc.

There is no point in New Zealand doing things differently becasue we have not taken IP seriously enough in the past and even in the present</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We should be alligned with the rest of the world. There is no point in having a different patent system to Europe, Eurasia, USA etc.</p>
<p>There is no point in New Zealand doing things differently becasue we have not taken IP seriously enough in the past and even in the present</p>
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		<title>By: Bevan</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-4857</link>
		<dc:creator>Bevan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 01:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-4857</guid>
		<description>Please send a submission to the Commerce Committee informing them that the Patents bill has forgotten to review software patentability, even when they said it would.  Also suggest that software should be added to the exclusion list.  See http://en.swpat.org/wiki/New_Zealand for details</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please send a submission to the Commerce Committee informing them that the Patents bill has forgotten to review software patentability, even when they said it would.  Also suggest that software should be added to the exclusion list.  See <a href="http://en.swpat.org/wiki/New_Zealand" rel="nofollow">http://en.swpat.org/wiki/New_Zealand</a> for details</p>
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		<title>By: John Rankin</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-4856</link>
		<dc:creator>John Rankin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 00:36:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-4856</guid>
		<description>As I read the new patents bill, every method of manufacture that is not specifically excluded is patentable. So I think we *do* need to propose an amendment to Clause 15 (exclusions), to state that computer software is not a patentable invention.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I read the new patents bill, every method of manufacture that is not specifically excluded is patentable. So I think we *do* need to propose an amendment to Clause 15 (exclusions), to state that computer software is not a patentable invention.</p>
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		<title>By: Lawrence D'Oliveiro</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-4850</link>
		<dc:creator>Lawrence D'Oliveiro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jun 2009 08:55:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-4850</guid>
		<description>Software is the only field of human endeavour where some are claiming the need for two kinds of legal protection—copyrights and patents. What’s so special about it, that it needs to double-dip the legal system? Everything else we do only gets one kind of protection.

There are also economic studies showing that patents as a whole have questionable effectiveness in “encouraging” invention. But that can be a war of words for another time. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Software is the only field of human endeavour where some are claiming the need for two kinds of legal protection—copyrights and patents. What’s so special about it, that it needs to double-dip the legal system? Everything else we do only gets one kind of protection.</p>
<p>There are also economic studies showing that patents as a whole have questionable effectiveness in “encouraging” invention. But that can be a war of words for another time. :)</p>
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		<title>By: Patents Roundup: Microsoft, Danger in New Zealand, and Rise of Opposition &#124; Boycott Novell</title>
		<link>http://it.gen.nz/2009/06/19/software-patents-unwelcome-and-unwanted/comment-page-1/#comment-4845</link>
		<dc:creator>Patents Roundup: Microsoft, Danger in New Zealand, and Rise of Opposition &#124; Boycott Novell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:42:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://it.gen.nz/?p=677#comment-4845</guid>
		<description>[...] most urgent news comes from New Zealand, where Free software folks have noticed some disturbing developments following similar recent attempts to disrupt copyright law.  Software [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] most urgent news comes from New Zealand, where Free software folks have noticed some disturbing developments following similar recent attempts to disrupt copyright law.  Software [...]</p>
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